埃及与中国同为世界文明古国，两国之间的交流始于古代丝绸之路，一直延续至今。2013年中国提出“一带一路”倡议，埃及是最早加入倡议的国家之一，且一直是“一带一路”的坚定响应者与参与者。
然而，有智库机构在谈到埃及与中国的全面战略伙伴关系时却认为，埃及加强与中国的双边关系，可能不为华盛顿所乐见，“中国在埃及不断增长的投资可能会威胁美国在埃及的经济利益”。
在“一带一路”框架下，中埃在哪些领域的合作取得了重大进展？中国在埃及的投资会威胁美国在埃及的经济利益吗？埃及如何看待中国在中东和全球的形象和影响？以金砖国家为代表的新兴市场国家和发展中国家崛起，反映出国际格局怎样的变化？
长安街知事（微信ID：Capitalnews）联合中国人民大学重阳金融研究院（微信公众号：人大重阳）推出“全球治理大家谈”栏目。埃及外交部前部长助理西夏姆·宰迈提（Hisham El-Zimaity）就“一带一路”倡议和中埃关系等与记者进行了分享。
西夏姆·宰迈提表示，埃及位于非洲、亚洲和欧洲三大洲的十字路口，这一战略位置是埃及制定外交政策的出发点。作为一个拥有1亿人口的国家，埃及在世界各地与每个国家都有多重利益往来。埃及是一个和平的国家，是一个希望发展的国家，也是一个展望未来的国家，我们知道自己需要什么，我们需要的是发展。
在这方面，中国是埃及在寻求发展道路上最好的朋友。中国是全球经济强国，是联合国安理会常任理事国，也是上海合作组织和金砖国家等组织的主导力量。所以当中国提出“一带一路”倡议时，我们愿意与之共同努力。中埃两国平衡而明智的外交政策，使我们彼此很容易克服西方那些言论的负面影响。
中企助力埃及建设
知事：我们看到您受邀参加了第三届“一带一路”国际合作高峰论坛，并且参加了智库交流专题论坛，您对本次大会有怎样的感受？
西夏姆·宰迈提：首先，我想说的是，我很荣幸能见证了这一重要论坛的举办。作为参与者，埃及也在为过去十年所取得的成就而庆祝，并期待下一个十年再创辉煌。
这种乐观情绪源于“一带一路”倡议的目标与埃及政府的国家计划“2030愿景”，以及涵盖整个非洲大陆的非洲发展计划“2063年议程”的高度契合。我们共同致力于消除贫困，确保非洲大陆和中东地区的稳定，努力实现可持续发展。
改革开放40多年来，中国使7.5亿人摆脱贫困，让他们成为了世界各地的消费者和旅行者，这份成功经验是我们大家都在寻找的典范。“一带一路”倡议的一个重要意义在于，它具有灵活性，可以根据世界形势的变化而变化。
知事：埃及是最早加入“一带一路”倡议的国家之一，您如何看待“一带一路”倡议过去十年的发展成就？
西夏姆·宰迈提：“一带一路”倡议拥有多重目标，这极为重要，它不仅限于改善或建设新的道路、港口、铁路和工业区，也在教育和卫生等重要领域发挥作用，这些领域是新兴国家发展的关键所在。
在疫情期间，中国向埃及提供必要的疫苗和医疗设备，使其成为服务于更广泛的非洲大陆的中心。中国和埃及向世界展示了卫生领域合作的榜样。这只是一个简单的例子，中埃合作的案例比比皆是。
数字丝绸之路在埃及的教育方面也发挥着至关重要的作用，使埃及的青年能够应对未来的挑战，提早为他们毕业后的人生做好了准备，确保他们有能力为自己承担责任，应对挑战，为社会做出有意义的贡献。
知事：“一带一路”对埃及的发展有何意义？在“一带一路”框架下，中埃在哪些领域的合作取得了重大进展？
西夏姆·宰迈提：埃及很早就参与“一带一路”倡议，中埃领导人也多次举行会晤，体现了埃及对“一带一路”倡议目标的坚定承诺。
中埃在“一带一路”框架下合作的一个典型例子，就是中企积极参建苏伊士运河经济区。目前，约有130家中国企业入驻该经济区，项目涵盖电子、纺织、汽车制造、交通运输、机械、新能源、石化、基础设施等多个领域，工作区域面积达5亿平方米。
中企还参与了埃及首都开罗附近“新行政首都建设计划”的中央商务区（CBD）建设，以及承建了阿拉曼新城超高综合体项目建设。
2023年5月10日，中国建筑展示的埃及新行政首都中央商务区项目。今年10月，中国和埃及签署了一项关于债转发展合作的谅解备忘录，为埃及有关发展项目提供资金支持，这是中埃合作的一个里程碑。这一创新合作模式将部分债务资金用于绿色经济、公共卫生、技术和职业培训等领域的“小而美”的项目。这次尝试将成为未来中国与其他发展中国家合作的典范。
知事：在“一带一路”倡议下，中国和中东在哪些领域展开了合作，倡议对中东地区有怎样的影响？
西夏姆·宰迈提：今年6月，在沙特利雅得召开的中阿合作论坛第十届企业家大会上，双方共签署了30项、总价值超700亿元人民币的经贸协议，这是中阿合作结出的硕果。中阿合作前景广阔、意义重大，阿拉伯-非洲区域有超过65个国家参与“一带一路”，占所有共建国家的将近一半。
中阿合作涉及的议程不仅包括体育、道路、卫生和教育的发展，还包括能源、可再生资源和本土工业等关键部门，致力于推动中东和非洲地区的工业化发展，并搭建起合理平衡的经济结构，促进双方全面和互利的伙伴关系。
与所有人都为友
知事：阿拉伯研究与政策中心（ACRPS）的附属机构华盛顿阿拉伯中心（ACW）在谈到埃及与中国的全面战略伙伴关系时认为，埃及试图加强与中国的双边关系，可能不为华盛顿所乐见，“中国在埃及不断增长的投资可能会威胁美国在埃及的经济利益”。您如何看待这种说法？
西夏姆·宰迈提：在1955年，埃及总统纳赛尔与中国总理周恩来举行了历史性的会晤，埃及强调了对不结盟运动原则的承诺，那就是与所有人都为友，不与任何人为敌。
埃及位于非洲、亚洲和欧洲三大洲的十字路口，这一战略位置是我们制定外交政策的出发点。作为一个拥有1亿人口的国家，埃及在世界各地与每个国家都有多重利益往来。埃及是一个和平的国家，是一个希望发展的国家，也是一个展望未来的国家。在地缘政治中保持平衡并不难，因为我们知道自己需要什么，我们的人民需要什么，我们需要的是发展。不幸的是，我们远远落后了，我们需要向前推进。
在这方面，中国是我们在寻求发展道路上最好的朋友。中国是全球经济强国，是联合国安理会常任理事国，也是上海合作组织和金砖国家等组织的主导力量。所以当中国提出“一带一路”倡议时，我们愿意与之共同努力。
埃及采取平衡的外交政策，这种平衡对于驾驭复杂的国际关系，确保对外交往有助于国家的发展和福祉至关重要。中埃两国平衡而明智的外交政策，使我们彼此很容易克服你刚才所提到的那些言论的负面影响。
知事：当前，世界出现了“逆全球化”思潮，单边主义、保护主义明显上升，世界经济复苏乏力，经济全球化在今天为什么会遭遇逆流？您如何看待经济全球化的前景？“一带一路”倡议为经济全球化带来了哪些方面的助益？
西夏姆·宰迈提：可以说，“一带一路”倡议代表了全球化的新迭代，是“全球化的2.0模式”。相比之下，保护主义不会带来任何结果。我认为，各方必须保证世界贸易组织(WTO)的既定贸易规则有效运作，因为这些规则是集体商定的，对确保贸易公平至关重要。贸易应在一个所有相关方商定的框架内进行，没有任何一个国家可以单方面替其他国家做决定，合作共赢的经营方式对共同发展至关重要。
在当今相互关联的世界中，没有一个国家能够通过回到保护主义和限制多边贸易来阻止历史进程，也没有一个国家能够孤立地行事，一心只保卫自己的利益，肆意征收关税而不受到影响。这种做法既不切实际，也不可持续。
全球化成功的关键在于建立和遵守一套管理国际互动的规则。“一带一路”倡议是这一愿景的重要组成部分，为当代全球化成功所必需的框架作出了重要贡献。
知事：多年来，美西方渲染炒作“中国威胁论”，近来又诬称中国对其他国家和外资企业进行“经济胁迫”，以此来恐吓盟友。但我们看到，本届“一带一路”国际合作高峰论坛，有来自151个国家和41个国际组织的代表来华参会，注册总人数超过1万人，其中不乏来自美国的盟国的政界人士，企业家大会还达成了972亿美元商业合同。为什么有这么多国家愿意来到中国参加“一带一路” 国际合作高峰论坛？为什么连美国的盟友都没有被所谓的“中国威胁”吓住，这反映出什么问题？
西夏姆·宰迈提：我不喜欢“中国威胁”这种说法，因为不存在所谓的“经济胁迫”或所谓的“债务陷阱”，以及那些我们不时就会听到的说法。
每个主权国家的政府都对自己的决定负责，他们会认真考虑什么才是最符合本国人民利益的选择。他们只签署对自己有利的文件。因此没有必要随意指认一个“陷阱”，因为没有人落入陷阱，也没有人遭到强迫。
中国一直在积极帮助发展中国家，特别是非洲的发展中国家升级其基础设施、工业和交通。今年10月中国举办的第三届“一带一路”国际合作高峰论坛取得了巨大成功，就是驳斥“威胁论”最有力的论证，有来自151个国家和41个国际组织的代表来华参会，如此多的参与者体现了全球商业运作方式的积极转变，这一成就是我们都应该感到高兴和自豪的。
知事：中国的发展道路是当今全球热议的话题。很多国家赞赏中国的发展道路，也有些国家将中国描绘为所谓“扩张性国家”。您如何看待中国的角色？如何看待中国在中东在全球的形象和影响？
西夏姆·宰迈提：在全球事务领域，一国强加于另一国的观念是站不住脚的。每个主权国家的政府都有权自主决定本国的行动方针。所以，当中国愿意提供优质高效且有助于发展进步的选项时，这些国家就会欣然接受，他们知道自己在选择什么，因为这就是他们拥有的最好选择。政府会根据他们认为最有利的条件作出选择。
因此，指责中国、指责任何人都没有意义，因为各国都有权利选择符合其利益的伙伴关系，有权决定自己的行动，决定在哪里、与谁合作。在这方面，正如我刚才所说，“一带一路”倡议是帮助发展中国家的积极力量。多年来，中国助力非洲的发展中国家升级基础设施和工业力量，许多被忽视了100多年的基础设施在中国的帮助下进入现代化。在这个领域，中国值得被感谢。
当地时间2023年8月1日，埃及新行政首都的大型项目中，由中企承建的议会上院参议院新总部的外立面。确保世界范围的政治稳定至关重要
知事：今年8月，埃及正式成为金砖大家庭成员，成员身份将于明年1月1日生效。为什么有越来越多国家想加入金砖？
西夏姆·宰迈提：金砖国家本身就是一个伟大的发明，为“全球南方”的发展中国家带来了希望。它体现了合作和共享的潜力，表明通过共同努力可以取得成功。这就是金砖国家对许多国家具有吸引力的原因。金砖国家的魅力在于它能够吸引众多寻求共同发展平台的国家。
因此，埃及一直努力加入金砖国家。在我们与中国共同的外交努力下，埃及成功地做到了，将于明年1月1日正式成为金砖国家的一员。
金砖国家从最初的5个成员国扩大到如今的11个成员国，为贸易、项目开发提供了更多机遇。展望未来，该组织还有进一步扩员的潜力，可能有20个甚至25个国家将陆续加入，这对世界经济非常重要。中国、俄罗斯、印度、南非和巴西等主要国家的加入，确保了金砖国家将继续在塑造全球经济未来方面发挥关键作用。
知事：埃及已经成为金砖国家新成员。埃及将为金砖国家带来哪些优势？金砖国家又能给埃及带来哪些优势?
西夏姆·宰迈提：由于金砖国家是一个加强合作的平台，并为该集团的成员提供优惠待遇，埃及将通过与其他国家共同实施项目而受益。一项值得注意的倡议是埃及与南非正在推进的“开罗-开普敦之路”倡议，这是一个旨在促进两国之间合作与发展的倡议。埃及已经完成了本国的部分，将公路从北端延伸到南部边界，南非也积极参与其中。这个雄心勃勃的项目计划横跨整个非洲大陆，在促进印度洋和地中海之间的贸易方面具有巨大潜力，并减少对红海等替代路线的需求，这一点非常重要。
这只是金砖国家间合作的一个例子，埃及与中国的合作也正在双边层面不断深化，而不仅仅是在“一带一路”框架下。举例来说，在过去的半个月里，中埃双方合作的一个里程碑是埃及在中国银行间市场发行了价值5亿美元、大约35亿元人民币的可持续发展“熊猫债券”。埃及在中国推出这款债券，成为了中东和北非地区第一个发行人民币债券的国家，吸引了大量的中国投资者。
这是一个对埃及和中国来说都非常重要的双边项目，它允许两国货币——埃及镑和人民币——进行交易，而不需要中间货币，体现了埃及和中国之间直接接触的重要性。我希望这笔“熊猫债券”在中国取得成功，并为未来更多的发行铺平道路，推进两国之间更深层次的合作。
埃及正在努力将出口的触角扩展到其他市场，特别是广阔的中国市场。对于埃及的出口来说，中国市场的吸引力和重要性毋庸置疑，虽然目前的交易量没有预期的那么多，但预计随着时间的推移将会稳步增长。这种更紧密的经济一体化为互利合作创造了一个平台，促进了我们两国之间的经验和知识交流，中国在农业、工业和技术分享方面的专业知识，都是埃及急切所需的。
作为中埃合作的一部分，我们欢迎中国游客前往埃及，这会为两国的文化交流创造绝佳的机会。我们的目标是接待100万至200万的中国游客，埃及有很多东西可以向中国游客展示。此外，埃及有三所大学开设有孔子学院，教授汉语，分别为开罗大学、苏伊士运河大学和艾因·夏姆斯大学。实践已经证明，孔子学院在我们国家的年轻人中很受欢迎，他们想了解中国文明，想了解他们正在学习的汉语。这种对中国文化的渴望进一步巩固了我们两国合作的基础。
知事：今年，我们有一些新成员加入了金砖国家，包括沙特阿拉伯、埃及、阿联酋、阿根廷、伊朗和埃塞俄比亚。此外，在中国的推动下，非洲联盟今年也加入了G20。你认为为什么发展中国家越来越多地站在一起? 您认为以金砖国家为代表的新兴市场国家和发展中国家崛起，反映出国际格局怎样的变化？
西夏姆·宰迈提：发展中国家已经共同认识到，作为国家，我们需要合作以实现各自的发展愿望。多年来，埃及和中国都致力于促进各自社会的发展。2013年，中国提出了“一带一路”重要倡议，为实现发展目标指明了国际合作之路。埃及60%的人口年龄在25岁以下，培养一支年轻、有技能的劳动力大军势在必行。因此，与中国在教育、卫生和青年培训等领域的合作至关重要。这种合作不仅有利于埃及，也对其他发展中国家与中国交往具有重要的借鉴意义。我们希望同中国共同努力，确保我们的青年接受优质教育，拥有健康的体魄，并有能力迎接未来的挑战，共同迈向进步。
以金砖国家为代表的“全球南方”的崛起正在改变世界格局，构建世界经济政治新秩序。我们合作的决心坚定不移，我们也拥有成功合作的必要手段。这份对发展的渴望不仅限于埃及和中国，也包括金砖国家和“一带一路”倡议的共建国家。我们的集体目标是促进全球稳定，特别是在对发展至关重要的领域。
10月16日，埃及发行了中东和北非地区首笔可持续“熊猫债券”。
确保世界范围的政治稳定至关重要，因为它使我们能够获得共同发展进程所必需的资源，比如能源，和对技术进步至关重要的稀土、矿物等各种资源。我们也强调绿色发展，目光不局限于修建公路和铁路等传统基础设施，埃及将自己的发展定位放在可持续发展的前沿。
我们真诚地希望全球稳定。正如你所熟知的，当前中东的复杂局势突显了促进世界稳定的重要性。对抗和制造不必要的问题，不是我们寻求的解决办法。
相反，我们应该把重点放在合作上——合作开展业务，分享胜利成果，为我们各自的人民取得实实在在的成果。这一合作理念是中埃以及其他发展中国家为世界作出积极贡献的关键所在。
图源：视觉中国
以下为本次专访的英文原文：
Hisham El-Zimaity Interview: "I Dislike Hearing Them Speak About China Like That"
Egypt and China, both ancient civilizations, have a history of communication dating back to the ancient Silk Road, which has persisted to the present day. In 2013, China proposed the "Belt and Road" initiative, and Egypt was one of the earliest countries to join the initiative, consistently being a staunch responder and participant in the "Belt and Road."
However, some think tanks, when discussing the comprehensive strategic partnership between Egypt and China, suggest that Egypt strengthening its bilateral relations with China may not be welcomed by Washington. They argue that "China's growing investments in Egypt may threaten U.S. economic interests in the country."
Under the framework of the Belt and Road Initiative, in which areas have China and Egypt made significant progress in their cooperation? Will China's investments in Egypt pose a threat to U.S. economic interests in the country? How does Egypt perceive China's image and influence in the Middle East and globally? The rise of emerging market countries and developing nations, represented by the BRICS nations, reflects what kind of changes in the international landscape?
In collaboration with RDCY, Capital News has launched the “Global Governance Forum” section. Hisham El-Zimaity, a former Assistant Foreign Minister for International Organizations & Multilateral Diplomacy, former Secretary General of the Egyptian Council for Foreign Affairs, (ECFA), shared his views on the Belt and Road Initiative, China-Egypt relations and other issues with us.
In December 2014, Egypt and China established a comprehensive strategic partnership, and since then, the leaders of both countries have engaged in frequent diplomatic exchanges. Over the past decade, President Abdel Fattah el-Sisi and President Xi Jinping have met on multiple occasions, mutually agreeing to work towards the goal of building a community of shared destiny between Egypt and China in the new era. This commitment aims to elevate the level of bilateral relations, outlining a blueprint for the development of the two countries' relationship.
China has consistently supported Egypt's just stance in regional and international affairs. China highly appreciates Egypt's contributions to promoting African development and achieving peace in the Middle East. Simultaneously, Egypt actively supports China's position in safeguarding national sovereignty and development interests, providing steadfast support on issues concerning China.
On October 18, the Think Tank Conference of the Belt and Road Forum was held in Beijing. Ambassador Hisham El-Zimaity stressed the importance of the digitalization of the Belt and Road as artificial intelligence and robotic automation are now mainstream technologies, including driverless cars, assisted driving and advanced manufacturing, all of which will affect the way people work in the future.
In this interview, as for the Belt and Road Initiative, Ambassador Hisham El-Zimaity stressed that the multiple goals of the strategy of the Belt and Road Initiative (BRI) are extremely important. Because it is not only limited to improving or building new roads, ports, railways and industrial zones. One of the major significances of the BRI is that it is flexible enough to allow for changes according to what happens in our dynamic world.The strategy encompasses vital areas such as education and health, which are pivotal components for the development of emerging nations.
Ambassador Hisham El-Zimaity cited the example of the Suez Canal Economic Zone to illustrate the cooperation between China and Egypt under the Belt and Road Initiative framework. In the Suez Canal Economic Zone, a major Chinese company is actively engaged in industrial development. Currently, approximately 130 Chinese companies operate within this economic zone, contributing to projects spanning electronics, textiles, vehicle manufacturing, transportation, machinery, new energy, petrochemicals, and infrastructure, covering an expansive area of over 500 million square meters. This collaboration extends to the construction of the financial district in the new administrative capital near Cairo and Chinese companies involved in projects in the new city of Alamein along the Mediterranean.
Due to the infrastructure collaboration under the Belt and Road initiative, China and Egypt, two ancient civilizations, have become intricately connected.
As Egypt's economy and population have grown, the population of the capital city, Cairo, has exceeded 23 million, making it not only the largest city in Africa but also one of the most congested cities in the world. In response, the Egyptian government initiated a "relocation" plan in 2015, planning a new administrative capital in the eastern desert area of Cairo. The new capital covers an area of approximately 700 square kilometers, equivalent to the size of Singapore. The Central Business District (CBD) of the new administrative capital, occupying a total area of about 600,000 square meters, has a total building area of about 1.92 million square meters. The completion of the new administrative capital will relocate around 6.5 million people, as well as various government offices and foreign embassies.
The construction of a new administrative capital, especially the CBD project, naturally attracted the interest of many countries. When the project was internationally tendered, the competition was fierce, with participation from countries in the Middle East, the United States, Japan, and China. Ultimately, Chinese companies successfully won the bid and signed a $3 billion contract with the Egyptian government for the first phase of the project in 2017.
China is responsible for constructing the Central Business District (CBD) in the new administrative capital of Egypt, comprising a total of 20 individual buildings. This includes 10 high-rise commercial office buildings, 5 high-rise apartments, 4 high-end hotels, and a landmark tower. It is the largest construction project undertaken by China in a Belt and Road partner country to date. The most striking feature is the 385-meter-tall "Landmark Tower," Africa's tallest building, integrating various functions such as offices, hotels, commerce, and sightseeing, destined to become Egypt's new landmark.
Upon completion, Egypt will boast a world-class central business district, driving the development of the Suez Canal Economic Zone and the Red Sea Economic Zone. The project commenced construction in May 2018, and currently, the main structure of the CBD project has been completed, entering a comprehensive phase of interior decoration and electromechanical construction.
"To get rich, build roads first." China is leveraging traditional infrastructure projects to help African countries address basic needs for their people. Simultaneously, through new types of infrastructure projects, China is assisting African nations in embracing the Fourth Industrial Revolution, characterized by digital information technology. By combining traditional and innovative infrastructure, China has not only created a "miracle" of Chinese infrastructure in Africa, contributing to local economic growth, but has also brought new impetus to the global economy. This effort, within the framework of the Belt and Road Initiative, aims to forge a mutually beneficial "community of shared interests" between China and African nations, promoting common development and prosperity—a "community of shared destiny."
According to our information, Over the past decade, the governments of both countries have actively encouraged and promoted expanded economic and trade cooperation between their enterprises, resulting in the continuous development of bilateral trade. In the last ten years, the trade volume between Egypt and China has increased from around $10 billion to approximately $20 billion. Currently, there are over 360 Chinese-funded projects in Egypt, involving more than 160 Chinese-funded enterprises. China has remained Egypt's largest trading partner for nine consecutive years, with Egypt ranking as China's fourth-largest trading partner in Africa.
During this decade, Chinese investment stock in Egypt has nearly tripled. Chinese companies have participated in energy projects, port construction, and industrial park development in Egypt, contributing to the country's economic growth. Additionally, through collaboration with the Egyptian government, Chinese enterprises have established production bases within Egypt, further promoting employment and technology transfer. The Suez (TEDA) Economic and Trade Cooperation Zone, jointly established by both parties, has provided direct or indirect employment opportunities for over 50,000 Egyptians, serving as a crucial platform for fostering investment and technological cooperation between the two nations.
In response to the statement from some Middle East think tank suggesting that "China's growing investments in Egypt may threaten U.S. economic interests in the country," Hisham El-Zimaity expressed opposition. In his response, he underscored Egypt's commitment to the principles of the Non-Aligned Movement, which entails being friends with all and enemies with none.
Starting with Egypt's geographical location, Hisham El-Zimaity highlighted the factors that Egypt needs to consider when formulating its foreign policy. Situated at the crossroads of three continents—Africa, Asia, and Europe—Egypt's strategic location can sometimes pose challenges in understanding its foreign policy. But Egypt is a peaceful country, is a country that wants to develop, is a country that looks for the future. In this regard, China is our best friend in that part of development, being a global economic powerhouse, a permanent member of the United Nations Security Council, and a leading force in organizations like the Shanghai Cooperation Organization and BRICS, of which Egypt is to become a member in 2024. The balanced and wise foreign policies of both China and Egypt makes it easy for us to overcome any problems or anything that is said by such institutes.
Over the years, Western countries, especially the United States, have hyped up the "China threat theory", and recently accused China of using "economic coercion" against other countries and foreign enterprises in an attempt to intimidate U.S.’s allies. Hisham El-Zimaity does not agree with this perspective and openly states that he does not like the expression 'China threat', because there is no such thing as 'economic coercion' or the so-called 'debt trap' or all these terms that we hear from time to time.
Ambassador Hisham El-Zimaity emphasized that every government is accountable for its own decisions, carefully considering what is in the best interest of its people. And they only sign what is good for them. There is no need to say that this is a 'trap' because nobody falls into a trap and nobody falls into coercion.
Therefore, Ambassador Hisham El-Zimaity believes there is no reason to blame anyone.Because nations willingly choose partnerships that align with their interests. Not China nor other of imposing itself on other nations. Every nation has the will and the right to choose the partners, determine its actions, and decide where and with whom to collaborate.
At the same time, Ambassador Hisham El-Zimaity pointed out that China has consistently been making efforts to assist other developing countries in developing infrastructure, especially in Africa. He said that in this regard, the Belt and Road Initiative is a positive force, as he mentioned, helping developing countries. It's helping upgrade many of the infrastructure that have been neglected for 150 years or 100 years. Now they are becoming modern, they are becoming effective with the help of China.
The great success of the Belt and Road forum in October is just an example of how this game changer will change the way we do business together. This is very important. With the participation of 151 countries, 41 international organizations, and 10,000 participants, it exemplifies a positive shift in the way global business is conducted. This achievement is something that we should all be happy and proud of.
During the interview, Ambassador Hisham El-Zimaity also mentioned with reporters the initial intentions behind Egypt's joining the BRICS nations and his expectations for the BRICS countries.
Ambassador Hisham El-Zimaity emphasized that BRICS itself stands as a wonderful invention, offering hope for developing countries in the global South. It embodies the potential for collaborative efforts and shared achievements, demonstrating that success is attainable through joint endeavors. And this is why BRICS is attractive to many countries. The allure of BRICS lies in its capacity to attract numerous countries seeking a platform for collective progress. Egypt has been tempted to join the BRICS, and thanks to China’s diplomatic efforts, Egypt managed to do that, and will be happy on the 1st of January 2024 to be part of this very important group.
Ambassador Hisham El-Zimaity thinks that the development of BRICS countries like Egypt and China is changing the global landscape and create a new order in the world's economic and political affairs. Our determination to collaborate is unwavering, and we possess the necessary tools for successful cooperation. This commitment extends beyond Egypt and China; it encompasses all members of BRICS and countries participating in the Belt and Road Initiative. The collective goal is to foster global stability, particularly in areas crucial for development.
As a supplement, Ambassador Hisham El-Zimaity also expressed that with 11 member countries, BRICS represents a significant expansion from its initial five, providing greater opportunities for trade, project development, and mutual interests. Looking ahead, there is potential for further growth, with the possibility of 20 or even 25 countries uniting under this crucial economic alliance, which is very important for the world economy. The presence of major players like China, Russia, India, South Africa, and Brazil ensures that BRICS will continue to play a pivotal role in shaping the future of the global economy.
He repeatedly emphasized the current importance of global peace and stability. He pointed out that ensuring political stability worldwide is paramount, as it enables access to the resources essential for our collective development journey. This goes beyond energy; it includes securing access to rare earth minerals and various resources vital for progress. As we emphasize green development, going beyond traditional infrastructure like roads and railways, we are positioning ourselves at the forefront of shaping a sustainable future.
Lastly, he reiterated that this is very difficult to predict, our sincere hope is for global stability. The current complexities in the Middle East, as you are well aware, highlight the importance of fostering stability worldwide. Antagonism and the creation of unnecessary problems are not the solutions we seek. Instead, our focus should be on cooperation—collaborating to conduct business together, sharing in victories, and achieving tangible outcomes for our respective populations. This philosophy of cooperation stands as the key for China and Egypt, as well as for other developing nations, to contribute positively to the world stability.
Looking to the future, both China and Egypt will seize the opportunity presented by the implementation of the outcomes of this summit forum. With Egypt officially becoming a member of the "BRICS" and the African Union formally joining the G20, Egypt and China can actively promote the deep integration of the Belt and Road initiative and Egypt's "2030 Vision" within these two cooperation mechanisms.
They will continue to utilize Chinese equipment and manufacturing to assist Egypt in strengthening infrastructure construction. Furthermore, they will leverage Chinese technology to enhance cooperation in renewable energy fields such as green hydrogen, wind energy, and solar energy. In areas like aerospace, agricultural technology, digital economy, 5G networks, artificial intelligence, and public health, the two countries will continuously create new growth points.
Moreover, both countries can continue to innovate forms of collaboration, actively promote cultural exchanges between the two ancient civilizations, and work together to build a closer community of shared destiny between Egypt and China, advancing Sino-Egyptian relations to new heights.
Over the past decade, countries participating in the Belt and Road Initiative have upheld the Silk Road spirit with core values of peace, cooperation, openness, inclusiveness, mutual learning, and mutual benefit. With connectivity as a central theme, the initiative has facilitated policy communication, infrastructure connectivity, trade facilitation, financial integration, and people-to-people exchanges, achieving deeper economic integration, comprehensive development coordination, and substantial benefits sharing. The success of this summit once again demonstrates that China's direction in promoting the Belt and Road Initiative is correct, and the confidence of countries participating in the initiative is unwavering. The prospect of high-quality development for the Belt and Road Initiative is promising. Standing at a new historical starting point, we look forward to embarking on a new journey together with all parties, jointly creating a bright tomorrow for each country's path towards modernization!
Chinese Enterprises Contribute to Egypt's Development
Capital News: We noticed that you were invited to attend the third Belt and Road International Cooperation Forum and also participated in the Think Tank Exchange Forum. Could you please share your impressions of this conference?
Hisham El-Zimaity: Well, first, let me say that I was honored to have been among the participants in this very important forum. I can say that the participants were happily celebrating our achievements during the last 10 years and looking forward to the next 10 years to come. This optimism stems from the alignment of the Belt and Road Initiative (BRI) objectives with Egypt's national plan, known as Plan 2030, and the broader African development plan, Agenda 2063, encompassing the entire continent.
Our common goals are centered on eradicating poverty, ensuring stability in both the continent and the Middle East, and striving for sustainable development and profound people-to-people relationships.
China's successful experience in taking out 750 million individuals out of poverty, transforming them into consumers and travelers around the world, serve as a wonderful example that we all look for. And one of the major significance of the BRI is that it is flexible enough to allow for changes according to what happens in our dynamic world.
Capital News: Egypt is one of the earliest countries to join the Belt and Road Initiative. How do you view the developmental achievements of the Belt and Road Initiative over the past decade?
Hisham El-Zimaity: The multiple goals of the strategy of the Belt and Road Initiative (BRI) are extremely important. Because it is not only limited to improving or building new roads, ports, railways and industrial zones. The strategy encompasses vital areas such as education and health, which are pivotal components for the development of emerging nations.
And if we talk about the health, for example, during the pandemic, China and Egypt show the world a very noble example. The collaboration between the two nations involved China providing essential vaccines and medical equipment to Egypt, establishing it as a hub to serve the broader African continent. This is a very good example of cooperation in the health field. And that's just one example. I'm sure there are many to come.
Furthermore, the Digital Silk Road plays a crucial role in education, equipping our youth for the challenges that lie ahead. This initiative prepares them for the near future upon graduation, ensuring they are well-equipped to take on responsibilities by themselves and contribute meaningfully to society.
Capital News: How do you view BRI’s significance for Egypt's development? Within the framework of the Belt and Road Initiative, in which areas have China and Egypt made significant progress in cooperation?
Hisham El-Zimaity: Egypt's early participation in the Belt and Road Initiative (BRI) and the numerous summit meetings between President Xi Jinping and President Abdel Fattah el-Sisi underscore Egypt's unwavering commitment to the objectives of the initiative.
A prime example of this commitment is evident in the Suez Canal Economic Zone, where major Chinese companies actively engage in industrial development. Currently, approximately 130 Chinese companies operate within this economic zone, contributing to projects spanning electronics, textiles, vehicle manufacturing, transportation, machinery, new energy, petrochemicals, and infrastructure, covering an expansive area of 500 million square meters. This collaboration extends to the construction of the financial district in the new administrative capital near Cairo and Chinese companies involved in projects in the new city of Alamein along the Mediterranean.
But let me choose an example, which is, I think it is important. A significant milestone occurred last October when China and Egypt signed a debt swapping memorandum of understanding (MoU) for developmental projects, termed the 'debt-for-development projects.' This innovative cooperation model involves utilizing a portion of the debt funds for small yet impactful projects in areas such as green economy, public health, technical and vocational training. Once this exercise succeeds, which we all hope, it will be a model of cooperation between China and other developing countries in the future.
Capital News: Under the Belt and Road Initiative, in which fields have China and Middle Eastern countries engaged in cooperation, and what kind of impact has the initiative had on the Middle East region?
Hisham El-Zimaity: The China-Arab States Cooperation Forum, which convened in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, resulted in numerous decisions aimed at enhancing and deepening cooperation across various domains. This is of paramount significance, given that the Arab countries, combined with Africa, constitute nearly half of the participants in these transformative initiatives, boasting the involvement of over 65 countries in the Arab-African region. The collaborative agenda extends beyond the development of ports, roads, health, and education to encompass critical sectors such as energy, renewable resources, and the indigenous development of industry. The objective is to integrate industries into the fabric of both the African continent and the Middle East, fostering a comprehensive and mutually beneficial partnership.
Friendship with All: A Universal Approach
Capital News: The Arab Center Washington DC, an affiliate of the Arab Center for Research and Policy Studies (ACRPS), stated in reference to Egypt's strategic partnership with China that, “The US National Defense Strategy has identified China as the top threat to US national security interests. So, Cairo’s attempt to enhance its bilateral relations with China may be viewed by Washington as fraternizing with the enemy." and "Egypt’s strategic partnership with China opens the door for increased presence and influence for Beijing in the region, which would threaten US strategic interests in the long term." How do you perceive this viewpoint?
Hisham El-Zimaity: Let me begin by saying that Egypt's foundational role as a member of the Non-Aligned Movement since 1955. And let us not forget the historical meeting between President Nasser of Egypt and Chairman Zhou Enlai of China during that time underscores the enduring nature of Egypt's commitment to a foreign policy that aligns with the principles of the Non-Aligned Movement—friend to all and an enemy to none.
Situated at the crossroads of three continents—Africa, Asia, and Europe—Egypt's strategic location can sometimes pose challenges in understanding its foreign policy. But Egypt is a peaceful country, is a country that wants to develop, is a country that looks for the future. In this regard, China is our best friend in that part of development, being a global economic powerhouse, a permanent member of the United Nations Security Council, and a leading force in organizations like the Shanghai Cooperation Organization and BRICS, of which Egypt is set to become a member in 2024.
The balance and wise foreign policies of both China and Egypt makes it easy for us to overcome any problems or anything that is said by such institutes, as the one you mentioned earlier.
Capital News: Egypt is a traditional ally of the United States in the Middle East and North Africa region and is also recognized by the U.S. government as one of the "non-NATO major allies". In the geopolitical game where the United States attempts to suppress, slow down, or even obstruct China's development in the context of China's rise, how does Egypt balance its relationship with China?
Hisham El-Zimaity: Yes, as a country of 105 million people, Egypt has multiple interests everywhere in the world with every country and balancing the act is not difficult. Because we know what we need and our people need and our population needs. What we need is development. We are still behind, unfortunately, and we need to push forward. And when comes a friend like China, with a wonderful initiative like the BRI, then we have to continue to work together and make it a success and win win partnership. For all of us. The key to our approach lies in maintaining balance: we balance our foreign policy; we balance our relationships in order to maintain friendship with every nation. This equilibrium is essential for navigating the complexities of international relations and ensuring that our engagements contribute to the development and well-being of our nation.
Capital News: Currently, there is a global trend of "de-globalization," with a noticeable rise in unilateralism and protectionism, and the world economy is facing challenges in terms of recovery. Why is economic globalization hitting a snag today？
Hisham El-Zimaity: Maybe I can say that the Belt and Road Initiative (BRI) in itself is the globalization in its new version. It's a new form of globalization. In contrast, protectionism is not going to lead anywhere. The established rules of trade within the World Trade Organization (WTO) must be allowed to function effectively, as these rules were collectively agreed upon and crucial for ensuring fair trade relationships. The enforcement of WTO rules is essential, as trade should be conducted within an agreed-upon framework that benefits all parties involved. No single nation can decide for the rest. It's a wrong strategy. Instead, we should all be doing business together and winning together. A collaborative approach to doing business is essential for mutual success. This is how we perceive it from our side. Nobody can stop the course of history by going back to protectionism and limiting the role of multilateral trade, like I mentioned for the WTO.
Capital News: How do you view the prospects of economic globalization? In what ways has the Belt and Road initiative contributed to economic globalization?
Hisham El-Zimaity: As previously highlighted, the Belt and Road Initiative (BRI) represents a new iteration of globalization, often referred to as Globalization 2.0. In today's interconnected world, no nation can operate in isolation, safeguarding its borders and imposing tariffs without repercussions. Such an approach is impractical and unsustainable. The key to successful globalization lies in the establishment and adherence to a set of rules that govern international interactions. The Belt and Road Initiative is integral to this vision, contributing significantly to the framework necessary for the success of globalization in our contemporary era.
Capital News: Over the years, Western countries, especially the United States, have hyped up the "China threat theory", and recently accused China of using "economic coercion" against other countries and foreign enterprises in an attempt to intimidate U.S.’s allies. However, we can see that at this year's Belt and Road International Cooperation Forum, representatives from 151 countries and 41 international organizations attended the conference in China, with a total registration of over 10,000 people. Among them were political figures and entrepreneurs from allied countries of the United States. The business summit also resulted in commercial contracts worth 97.2 billion US dollars. Why are so many countries willing to come to China for the Belt and Road International Cooperation Forum? Why haven't even America's allies been deterred by the so-called "China threat"? What does this reflect?
Hisham El-Zimaity: I don't like the expression 'China threat', because there is no such thing as 'economic coercion' or the so-called 'debt trap' or all these terms that we hear from time to time. Each government is responsible for its decisions, carefully considering what is in the best interest of its people. And they only sign what is good for them. There is no need to say that this is a 'trap' because nobody falls into a trap and nobody falls into coercion.
On the contrary, China has been actively helping developing countries to upgrade their infrastructure, their industry, their transportation, especially in Africa. The great success of the Belt and Road forum in October is just an example of how this game changer will change the way we do business together. This is very important. With the participation of 151 countries, 41 international organizations, and 10,000 participants, it exemplifies a positive shift in the way global business is conducted. This achievement is something thatwe should all be happy and proud of.
Capital News: China's development path is a topic of global discussion today. Many countries appreciate China's development approach, while some portray it as a so-called "expansionist nation." How do you perceive China's role, especially China's image and influence in Middle East and globally?
Hisham El-Zimaity: In the realm of global affairs, the concept of one country imposing itself on another is untenable. Every country is sovereign, with the right and autonomy to decide its course of action. So, if China is offering something good, something useful, something that helps the development of the country, then they will go for it. They know what they are choosing, because it's the best option that they have. Governments make choices based on what they perceive as the most advantageous option.
So, there is no meaning of accusing anyone, because nations willingly choose partnerships that align with their interests. Not China or other of imposing itself on other nations. Every nation has the will and the right to choose the partners, determine its actions, and decide where and with whom to collaborate.
In this regard, the Belt and Road Initiative is a positive force, as I mentioned, helping developing countries. It's helping upgrade many of the infrastructure that have been neglected for 150 years or 100 years. Now they are becoming modern, they are becoming effective with the help of China. So, we should be thankful to China in this field.
Ensuring Global Political Stability is Paramount
Capital News: In August this year, Egypt officially became a member of the BRICS family, and its membership will take effect on January 1st next year. Why do more and more countries want to join BRICS?
Hisham El-Zimaity: BRICS itself stands as a wonderful invention, offering hope for developing countries in the global South. It embodies the potential for collaborative efforts and shared achievements, demonstrating that success is attainable through joint endeavors. And this is why BRICS is attractive to many countries. The allure of BRICS lies in its capacity to attract numerous countries seeking a platform for collective progress.
Egypt has been tempted to join the BRICS, and thanks to China’s diplomatic efforts, we have managed to do that, and we will be happy on the 1st of January 2024 to be part of this very important group.
With 11 member countries, BRICS represents a significant expansion from its initial five, providing greater opportunities for trade, project development, and mutual interests. Looking ahead, there is potential for further growth, with the possibility of 20 or even 25 countries uniting under this crucial economic alliance, which is very important for the world economy. The presence of major players like China, Russia, India, South Africa, and Brazil ensures that BRICS will continue to play a pivotal role in shaping the future of the global economy.
Capital News: Egypt has become a new member of the BRICS. What advantages will the Egypt bring to the BRICS nation? And what advantages will the BRICS nations bring to the Egypt?
Hisham El-Zimaity: As BRICS is going to be a platform for more cooperation and with special treatment for the members of that grouping, Egypt is going to benefit by implementing projects together with others. One notable initiative is the ongoing plan to construct a road connecting Cairo to Cape Town in South Africa. Egypt has completed its segment, extending from the northern tip to the southern borders, while South Africa is also actively involved. This ambitious road project, spanning the entire continent, holds great potential for facilitating trade between the Indian Ocean and the Mediterranean, perhaps eliminating the need for alternate routes like the Red Sea.
This is very important. That's just one example, but also cooperation with China is going to be deepened at the bilateral level, not only within the Belt and Road Initiative (BRI).And let me mention, for example, during the last 10 days, a recent milestone in this collaboration is the launch of 'panda bonds,' valued at $500 million, in China. We have launched this in China. It's about ￥3.5 billion. Egypt is the first country from the Middle East or Africa to issue bonds in Yuan, denominated at ￥3, attracting Chinese investors.
So, this is a bilateral project that is extremely important for Egypt and China. This bilateral project exemplifies the significance of direct engagement between Egypt and China, allowing transactions in our national currencies—Egyptian pound and Yuan, Renminbi—bypassing the need for intermediary currencies. I hope 'panda bonds' will be a success in China. The success of the panda bonds in China is anticipated to pave the way for future issuance, and maybe there will be more issuance to come, showcasing the depth of cooperation between the two nations. This is just to give you one example.
The primary objective of this endeavor is to expand our reach into other markets, with a particular emphasis on the vast Chinese market. For Egyptian exports, the Chinese market holds immense importance, and while our current exports may not be as substantial as desired, we anticipate steady growth over time. This closer economic integration creates a platform for mutual benefit, fostering an exchange of experiences and knowledge between our nations. China's extensive expertise in agriculture, industry, and knowledge transfer is something Egypt seeks to capitalize on.
As part of this collaboration, we aim to welcome a significant number of Chinese tourists to Egypt, with the goal of hosting one to two million visitors. Egypt has much to showcase, creating a wonderful opportunity for cultural exchange. Additionally, the presence of the Confucius Center in Egypt, teaching the Chinese language, has proven popular among our youth who want to learn about the Chinese civilization, the Chinese language, which they are learning. The eagerness is further solidifying the foundation for cooperation between our nations.
Capital News: We've got some new members joining the BRICS club this year, like Saudi Arabia, Egypt, UAE, Argentina, Iran, and Ethiopia. Also, thanks to China's push, the African Union hopped on board with the G20 this year. Why do you think developing countries are increasingly standing together? What does the rise of emerging markets and developing countries, represented by BRICS countries, reflect about the changing international landscape?
Hisham El-Zimaity: The essence of our cooperation stems from the mutual recognition that we, as nations, need each other to achieve our developmental aspirations. Over the years, both Egypt and China have been dedicated to advancing our societies. The turning point came in 2013 when China presented a significant initiative BRI that illuminated the collaborative pathways, we could embark upon to realize our development goals.
With 60% of our population under the age of 25, Egypt faces the imperative of nurturing a young and skilled workforce. Cooperation in areas such as education, health, and preparing the youth for the job market becomes crucial. This collaboration is not only beneficial for Egypt but also holds significance for other developing nations engaging with China. Together, we seek to ensure that our youth receive quality education, maintain good health, and are equipped to meet the challenges of the future, fostering a shared journey toward progress.
I think that the development of BRICS countries like Egypt and China is changing the global landscape and create a new order in the world's economic and political affairs. Our determination to collaborate is unwavering, and we possess the necessary tools for successful cooperation. This commitment extends beyond Egypt and China; it encompasses all members of BRICS and countries participating in the Belt and Road Initiative. The collective goal is to foster global stability, particularly in areas crucial for development.
Ensuring political stability worldwide is paramount, as it enables access to the resources essential for our collective development journey. This goes beyond energy; it includes securing access to rare earth minerals and various resources vital for progress. As we emphasize green development, going beyond traditional infrastructure like roads and railways, we are positioning ourselves at the forefront of shaping a sustainable future.
Again, this is very difficult to predict, our sincere hope is for global stability. The current complexities in the Middle East, as you are well aware, highlight the importance of fostering stability worldwide. Antagonism and the creation of unnecessary problems are not the solutions we seek. Instead, our focus should be on cooperation—collaborating to conduct business together, sharing in victories, and achieving tangible outcomes for our respective populations. This philosophy of cooperation stands as the key for China and Egypt, as well as for other developing nations, to contribute positively to the world.
END
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